Should myki be cancelled?

[myki user]

There has been lots of press in the last few days about canceling myki, with some very silly statements going around.

Take http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/state- ... 5895844675

The first few questions raised by this are

Why would it cost $1 Billion to end the contract?
Why is it 'frightening' to walk away?
Why does metcard have to be turned of in 2012?

Why would it cost $1 Billion to end the contract

Indeed, why would it cost anything? Haven't they just got a contract to build the system? Or has the government guaranteed to pay them for 10 years of running it even if they don't? If so, this would have to take the cake as the stupidest contract this government has signed - which is really saying something!

Why is it 'frightening' to walk away?

Throwing good money after bad is more frightening than walking away! How we should be making the decision is figuring out how expensive it is going to be to make it work vs what the other options are ie buying an off shore system. If it will be cheaper to scrap it and buy another system, that is what we should do, no matter how much money we have wasted on the system to date...

Why does metcard have to be turned of in 2012?

Why? It seems to be working OK, what artificial event happens in 2012?


In short, we (the public) don't have enough information to be able to judge if it should be scrapped or not. We would need someone independent to evaluate where we are at, the cost of the different options, and then recommend a way forward. But to dismiss scrapping it out of hand without doing that is absurd.

[Peter Mount]

I was under the impression they stopped making the hardware for the Metcard system. Myki's introduction was a joke but do we have time to come up with a different system?

I've noticed a lot of people don't seem to want to accept that Myki can improve. I've used it for about 6 months this year on trains and I've noticed some improvement over that time.

[myki user]

The point is that they have had 5 years to 'improve it' - and wouldn't the FIRST thing to be done is get a reader and a card and see how well they work? If this is the result of 5 years work, then extrapolating forward it will be another few decades and another few $billion to get the system up to the speed and reliability of the overseas systems...

[Peter Mount]

They have improved it, at least on trains. I'm the first to admit the first 4 or so years were a joke but to be deny they have made some improvement is wrong.

Plus is there time to scrap Myki and bring in a new system? Is it or is it not true they have stopped making replacement hardware for Metcard?

[myki user]

Yep - there has been some improvement, but given they have had 5 years it has be pretty pathetic. The system should have been able to read cards better than this when they were prototyping (if they did any) in the first 6 months...

I Still haven't heard a single reason on why metcard needs to be scrapped in 2012 - it it's just parts get someone to make them, that's not very expensive compared to the money that has been spent on myki!

[VoiceOfReason]

Well, I can't wait for the bill when the state gets sued for stealing OneLink's intellectual property when they fabricate Metcard components without a licence to do so. At least it will make Myki look cheap!

Metcard is falling apart. Every day the ERG technicians are around the network trying to keep the same hardware from working without completely keeling over. The EFTPOS system used by all the machines is no longer supported by the bank providing it and they are going to turn it off.

The terminals in the station offices are apparently an absolute nightmare to use, and from all first hand reports the new Myki terminals are a dream to use (when they eventually get rolled out, which can't happen until the Metcard equipment is removed).

[VoiceOfReason]

In addition (this crappy forum software has been set to effectively prevent any editing of posts), say we were to replace every bit of metcard hardware (which is pretty much what is required. The barriers are ALL life expired, despite looking ok from the outside), and the validators arent faring much better. Thats not going to cost that much less than Myki!

I have been told from a few sources that the ongoing operation cost of Metcard + the Vline ticketing system is greater per-year than that of Myki. Remember, $1.35billion is NOT the cost of buying and installing the system.

I'd love to see how much Metcard cost to implement and run for 10 years, indexed for 2010 dollars.

[Penny]

...I'd love to see how much Metcard cost to implement and run for 10 years, indexed for 2010 dollars.

The initial Onelink contract in 1994 was worth $712 million for ten years (1998-2007), $332 million for development and installation and $38 million per year for operation and maintenance. An additional $65 million was paid in 2001 to Onelink to enable the machines at stations to function properly and to enable daily tickets to be available on trams. In 2010 dollars, this is $1.19 billion.

Also, as you point out, the state does not own Metcard, Onelink does, so it is not a matter of just "keeping" Metcard. Onelink said, seven years ago, that Metcard would need to be replaced in 2008, which is why the smartcard tenders were called. Under the original contract, the state could have purchased the Metcard system from Onelink at the conclusion of the contract in 2007 for a price equivalent to the initial purchase price ($332 million) indexed for inflation - $470 million. On top of that, the state would then have had to operate and maintain the system. Currently, Onelink is receiving $42 million per year for the contract extension to operate and maintain. These amounts do not include the cost of developing, operating and maintaining country and regional ticketing systems (which are included in Myki).

Not spending $1.35 billion on Myki would not have saved this amount of money to enable it to be spent on other items e.g. more trains. The only way that would occur would be to have no ticketing system at all. There is no jurisdiction in the world where this happens for rather obvious reasons (massive increases in patronage, costs and system abuse).

[Scruffy]

There is a lot of misinformation about the Mecard system.

It has excellent customer satisfaction ratings (see Track Record).

Nothing is falling apart - contrary to some popular rumours. Metcard is operating more reliably than ever before and all parts are available to continue maintenance - and any of the new EFTPOS terminals on the market can be put in the old machines. No reason the Metcard system can not operate for another ten years.

[VoiceOfReason]

Thank you Penny! That information is exactly what I was looking for! What are your sources? I have faith in your information, however others may not.

It puts Myki into perspective. Metcard has been more expensive than Myki, once you take into account the fact that Metcard doesn't cover V/Line and the other operators myki end up covering, like Skybus, and the fact that Metcard can't handle as many passengers as Myki.